THE BISHOPS GOT IT WRONG
Note: Comments of readers are their own and do not reflect the feelings of Bob Lonsberry or lonsberry.com.
# 1. 12/13/12 12:42 AM
And if they be blind leaders of the blind...they shall all fall in the ditch. I think I understand that better now. Unfortunately, those bishops will probably not see any more clearly even after your excellent explanation. If they can't get the basics right, how can anyone put any confidence in anything they teach?
# 2. 12/13/12 1:03 AM by Cal - Rochester, NY
What a lovely Christian Christmas message for the truth!
These 4 Bishops sound like commie libs to me...subverting America for its downfall!
# 3. 12/13/12 3:09 AM by hunter - e. bethany, ny
Misinformation is everywhere. Chilling.
# 4. 12/13/12 3:53 AM by B Smith - Syracuse New York
Frankly your both irrelevant in this modern world. The Catholic Church can't close churches fast enough to keep up with demand and Mormons can knock on all the doors they want, but will never be more than a side show along the road of progress.
# 5. 12/13/12 6:19 AM by Bob Wheaton - Crofton MD
Amen Bob! You perfectly dissected the collective salvation twisting of the gospel of Christ being pedaled today.
# 6. 12/13/12 6:27 AM by OldVietVet - Rochester, NY
The Bishops have written a bogus bulletin. Jesus Christ preached to the Jews, and not to the Gentiles-Roman or Greek. That was left to St. Paul to do that.And Jesus Christ was concerned with one thing-the Kingdom of God.And the question of Church and State,with taxation the wedge issue, was settled by his brilliant turning of the tables- "Render unto Caesar" etc. was his comeback.Sound familiar? The Bishops ought to trash the talking points of the Democratic Party in favor of the parables by Jesus Christ-if they be serious about their professed religion.
# 7. 12/13/12 6:28 AM by Sharon - Hiton, NY
# 8. 12/13/12 6:37 AM by Poplar Beach
When I wonder why I left the church (all of them) 40 years ago, this drivel from the bishops pretty much covers it.
I am betting these guys did not vote for Mitt Romney!
I had three service folks at my house this week, I usually offer them coffee and tip them.
One had a blue tooth in and was engrossed in a conversation with the air, he put out a pad for me to sign, not a word was said, at least to me.
The other two guys spent most of their time complaining about pretty much everything, including unthinking RICH people, it was obvious both thought they were getting the short shaft.
The social justice war is in full swing, thank you so much Mr. president, you are quite the leader!
# 9. 12/13/12 6:44 AM by rjd
And that is why the Catholic church is fading. If this is the crap they are passing off to their flock it is no surprise. Christ was just a community organizer, I like that one. This is what happens when the left tries to be spiritual...not a pretty sight is it? Better leave God out of your propaganda, you have no clue what you are talking about Bishop. If I would have heard a sermon like that when I was a Catholic I'd would have walked right out the door, life is too short to listen to bullcrap.
# 10. 12/13/12 7:07 AM by Fly
Organized religion putting words in God's mouth to conform to their hidden agenda. Who can you trust anymore? And B+L goes to the Chinese to screw J+J. Hardball time - Kodak patents only offered $325 mil, will go for $380 mil.
# 11. 12/13/12 7:40 AM by pp - r
We would all do well to keep politics out of religion and religion out of politics.
Governing without fairy-tale dogma would be ideal. Political discussions without zealotry would be awesome, and we might actually get something done.
# 12. 12/13/12 7:54 AM by little john - Mount Morris, NY
“The vulnerable Baby of the manger points to a call in our time that we are to work for a vision of the human community that seeks the good of all over personal gain." B.L. It appears to me you are speaking of the have nots and the haves of too much. Who AM I to judge, those who have walked in poverty, or those who have ridden in ungodly style on walled streets of omnipotent corporate security???
# 13. 12/13/12 8:09 AM by Sean - Penfield
All Religions have origins when mankind was less educated. If one is able to seperate ones self from past indoctrination, which almost always occurred at a very young age, one would see the absurdity in all of theses “made for profit and control” belief systems.
So I pose this to you; rather then argue interpretations argue why mankind has clung to these illogical, absurd, & higharchical belief systems!
# 14. 12/13/12 8:24 AM by Craig - Fairport, NY
Bob, The liberal left is trying to re-write our history and now the Roman Catholic church is attempting to re-write biblical history to coincide with that same liberal agenda. All of this is wrong. Wasn't the cold war about stopping such things? Didn't the west supposedly win and put a stop to such things? We are now becoming what was so hated for so long.
# 15. 12/13/12 8:28 AM by Fred - Brockport
And all this challenge from a man who's Mormon religion was founded by a con man.... Joseph Smith.
# 16. 12/13/12 8:29 AM by RC - Bloomington
And all the people said, Amen.
# 17. 12/13/12 8:29 AM by GEORGE (THE OTHER ONE) - GANANOQUE ONTARIO CANADA
One can debate the relevance of any of these stories that come from a book that has been re-written numerous times and sourced in fables as old as the human race.
One cannot debate the importance or influence of the original message from the Christian Churches and the effect these messages had on the formation of western society. The failure of the modern Christian Church is directly linked to the failure of western society.
The nasty people who lived on the other side of Churchill's 'iron curtain' used to threaten the west with defeat from within. Little did we know that they were not referring to 'fifth columnists', imbedded communists or internal subversions. They really meant that western society would fall when the Christian churches fell.
And here, we clearly see, that the Christian churches have been infected by the anti-Christ of communism. This article could be written about the present situation in America by substituting 'Barrack obama' in place of any mention of Christ. How sad that these religious people believe their own lies.
It is now up to people like you Bob to shine the light of truth on this nest of vipers. Nock them down Bob.
# 18. 12/13/12 8:43 AM by Matt - Rochester, NY
Hey #2---Cal---I think someone needs to check your bedroom at home. I envision you having half nudes of Bob splattered all over your bedroom walls. My God! Your lips must be raw from all the Bob butt kissing! I am sure the goal of the Bishops is to bring down America. Are you for real? If so, lets hope the local authorities are keeping tabs on you....
# 19. 12/13/12 8:45 AM by Scott - Henrietta, New York
To all, read the Bible, make your own decisions. I recommend that people new to the Bible and/or Christianity, read the "Book of John", then read "Genesis."
The "Book of John" tells about God's love for us.
"Genesis" is an early history of our relationship with God.
Don't let religious leadership tell YOU what YOU believe. Find out about God's love for yourself.
# 20. 12/13/12 8:48 AM by Matt - Rochester, NY
Hey Fred from Brockport----you are exactly right. Couldn't say it any better. Only I will add L Ron Hubbard as the reincarnation of Joseph Smith----nothing but a con.
# 21. 12/13/12 8:50 AM by Christopher - Newport News, VA
# 22. 12/13/12 8:53 AM by Jodi - Wayne County East
Jesus came not to abolish the Law but to fulfill it, and to seek and to save those that are lost.
His first coming was that of spiritual Savior, Redeemer of the Heart the Soul. The Lamb of God.
His second coming will be of Conqueror, King and Restorer of His Kingdom on Earth. The Lion of the Tribe of Judah.
Do you know Jesus as your personal Lord and Savior? Have you repented of your personal shortcomings and sin?
Are you death, rapture, antichrist, and second coming ready?
# 23. 12/13/12 9:00 AM by tom - penfield, ny
Sounds to me like they are saying that Emperor Caesar Augustus as more like Mitt Romney and Jesus is more like Obama. Bob, you are going to need to go through the reeducation program to wipe all those weird thoughts out of your head. We have been watching you and we are getting more concerned all the time.
# 24. 12/13/12 9:04 AM
# 25. 12/13/12 9:12 AM
You always deny being "Christian" (except when you are spewing some lame version thereof) so why do you get so exorcised by something from a bunch of bishops? Peace.
Editor's Note: i've never denied being christian. i've always wished i was worthy of the name.
# 26. 12/13/12 9:14 AM by Rachel - Greece, NY
I don't really care about four Bishop's Christmas message.
I’d like to know why God starved 40,000 children to death today...and yesterday...and tomorrow Nice guy...starving kids and giving them AIDS and cancer What kind of message is that?
# 27. 12/13/12 9:17 AM by eric petersen - WA
Wow Bob, Even the church has been infiltrated with commies, It's no wonder the mess from the storm is still not cleaned up, that Mayor Foodberg cares more about the size of a drink than the effective governing of a city, That New York has Bishops of this lack of spine and character must rankle the Lord to no end. Satan is winning, The Bishops should go to Cuba
# 28. 12/13/12 9:18 AM by Neil McKenna - Ontario, NY
Just when we thought we're on our way back to traditional Catholicism, we "discover" that our apostolic administrator has "gone" liberal on us. Boy, what an eye opener that is!!
Thanks Bob. I think you "nailed it."
# 29. 12/13/12 9:19 AM by Human Error
Why does God even bother with us stupid humans? I know, I know, we are his children. But if I had kids like us I would disown them. I know, I know, that's why I am not God.
# 30. 12/13/12 9:21 AM by Fran - Elba
Thank you Bob! I can feel your devotion to Jesus Christ right through your words. Those Bishops don't know what the hell they are talking about.
# 31. 12/13/12 9:22 AM
I suppose you believe the bishops message was further indication of the right's imagined "war on Christmas". The column today is just another prop for Bob's righteous indignation he constantly needs to expound upon when someone(s) doesn't believe exactly like himself. Wah-wah-wah. And personally? Jodi is so incredibly tedious that I hope that come 12/22/12, she will finally be joyous......and finally silent
# 32. 12/13/12 9:23 AM by Tom Dey - Springwater, NY
It's damned spooky when the liberal political agenda even overtakes the Christmas message. Worse - it DISPLACES it! Creepy and disheartening. One more reason I'm a drop-out Catholic. I believe this technically condemns me to the everlasting fires of hell. And, yeah...the writing style is at a mediocre middle-school level. I may be a doubting Thomas, but Jesus came to atone for man's sins - hence salvation and celebration. If that gets forgotten...we truly are doomed.
# 33. 12/13/12 9:27 AM
Duh! (?) TIME readers pick North Korea's Kim Jung A-hole as Man 0f the Year!
Now I've seen everything! Gimme a break!
# 34. 12/13/12 9:37 AM by jim - Rochester NY
It always truly amazes me that people pick and chose the quotes they want and then throw away the rest. For such an intelligent guy like you, you missed your calling. You are a preacher with a myopic congregation.
How do you plan to remove the speck from the bishops eye, while you have a log in yours?
Didn't Jesus say "for what does it profit a man to gain the world' but to lose his soul?"
"It is easier for a camel to fit through the eye of a needle than for a wealthy man to make it to heaven"
Yes Jesus' birth life and death was to save all mankind, but if you look at the bible his work was mainly with the dispossessed, the outcast, and the down trodden. Thats not to say the wealthy and privileged could not be saved, but he warned them about their lifestyles. Its the money exchangers at the temple , that incur his anger.
And to imply that Mary and Joseph went to Bethlehem for a census count is is absurd. Census's were taken at the time so that taxes could be levied.
How can I over look the possibility that God "is no respecter of persons" or values one person over another. When the JEWISH PEOPLE, ARE THE CHOSEN PEOPLE?. And how can you doubt that not only is Jesus a challenge to the hierarchy of Rome and Israel, at the time, But a challenge to paganism itself? Jesus was persecuted by the Jews for attacking the hierarchy of the pharisees! the ruling elite.
Christs life, was also about a life style. Thats why there is repentance. And does the fact that Jesus lived within the confines of Roman law, and Jewish law at the time mean that, that life style was acceptable? Slavery was part of the social structure of the time. Does that mean slavery was acceptable to God? your view point could be acceptable to Rep. Preston Brooks. And what about the brutality of the times. Did jesus offer any sermons in support of them. No But he had to live within the social structure ergo you only render unto Ceaser what belongs to Ceaser, But you also render unto God what belongs to God.
# 35. 12/13/12 9:38 AM
A radio talk show host vs the Bishop of Syracuse, a Theologian I might remind our readers. So, its you vs him, your right and he is wrong, or he is right and you are wrong. I promise you that none of your readers has the answer to this question, including myself. So where do we go from here? Furthermore, its the Communist Manifesto of Karl Marx, which has good and bad points, just like yourself.
# 36. 12/13/12 9:54 AM by Ceps - Baldwinsville, NY
This whole thing is stupid. You have clueless "church leaders" being critiqued by a clueless Rush Limbaugh wannabe hate monger who has a second rate radio show on a few second rate minor radio stations. I love the way the self righteous hide behind the term "Christian" thinking it will hide the demonic nature that spews from their mouths. Bob, you're no better than the apostate bishops you judge.
# 37. 12/13/12 10:41 AM by Cj
Rachel - God doesn't starve people - wars and genocide are what men start which kills & starves children -
war on terrorism = increased more terrorism war on drugs = increased drugs
as for the column about the Bishops, (men) they do seem to contradict themselves talking against domination and then talking about subversion.
However, sadly Bob you still choose to be irresponsible and play the blame game on the imaginary "commie libs" which is creating more space to make yourself look like another right wing delusional wacko nutcase teaparty follower who worship Ayn Rand and think you carry the country on your shoulders and are about the 2nd coming of Christ who is picking you guys up. (Jodie & Cal)
Can we so easily forget that it was George Bush Sr. who first started talking about the New World Order? did you question that?
Do you ever criticize what your church leadership ever says and they say some goofy things as well such as they never get involved in politics. Yeah right. Prop. 8 comes to mind.
# 38. 12/13/12 10:47 AM by Adk Hiker
The Catholic Church is the largest cult and business in the world. Pay no attention to those people behind that curtain dressed in fancy robes and funny hats.
They are hypocrites and vipers.
# 39. 12/13/12 12:02 PM by Joe - Ocala, Florida
The Bishops message seems to fly in the face of everything I was taught by my Grandmother about Jesus, and everything I learned in Sunday School or read in the Bible. It is a slap in the face of Christianity. The statement takes away everything that can be attributed to god and makes Christianity a political agenda.
# 40. 12/13/12 12:18 PM
Re:Editor's note to #25 - "i've never denied being christian." But you have previously said that "i've never claimed to be christian". Is you is or is you ain't? You're looking more slippery than Romney, which is nearly impossible to be.
Editor's Note: the quote you attribute to me is inaccurate. i am going to hell, i am a failed christian, but i am nonetheless a christian.
# 41. 12/13/12 12:34 PM by Michael - Pitts
Wow. Christ being born of a virgin from humble beginnings is simply God telling us that you need nothing in this life, but the love of God. No possessions, no title, no standing. It was that beginning, and the life he lead, that made Jesus's crown and glory what it is. An ordinary man (in the sense of birth) beats it all. Saves us all and shows the world for all eternity that yes it is possible to live for the WORD and only the WORD. He who had no authority, had all the authority as evidenced by his overturning of the tables in the temple and teaching the church at a very early age. He wasn't subverting Roman power, he was directly challenging it. If you remember he said directly, Only the authority the my Father in heaven has given you. Not to mention the many time he challenged the scribes and Pharisees who worked directly with Rome to control the people. I don't know what that message from those clergy people was supposed to provide, but I can tell you many lay people who could deliver a better message. You being one of them.
Editor's Note: the scribes and pharisees worked directly with jerusalem, not rome.
# 42. 12/13/12 12:43 PM by Jerry - Rochester
You have no idea how relatively tame this is for this group of Clergy. The Bishop you cited from the ELCA (Lutheran) has far more extreme positions than you could ever imagine. Her public statements tend to run mildy off-balance like this, but in private discussions she would (and does!) make her real agenda known. Community Re-organizing is putting it politely!
# 43. 12/13/12 1:05 PM by William
It displayed a stunning ignorance of Christianity
Ok Bob, let me get this straight. A former Mormon knows more about Christianity that the Bishops of the Holy Catholic Church.
You arrogance is startling.
# 44. 12/13/12 1:25 PM by Cami
the eye of the needle scripture I think gets misinterpreted as there is a large gate in Egypt which translated says the eye of the needle so means it's easy for a rich man to get into heaven although I think it's simple to get into heaven. Not necessarily easy.
I think Jesus Immanuel didn't like bullies and bullies existed before the self esteem experiment started and they still exist because it used to be thought bullies had no self esteem but they do and are sociopaths who enjoy the suffering of others and have followers who praise and enable them.
The corrupt rich is who Jesus Immanuel is NOT for and who can stop them but the non-corrupt rich as the poor have no power. Look at who our politicians and Judges work for but their largest donors who are then awarded ambassadorships and other positions.
Those who speak for the poor and help the poor in teachings or otherwise, are blessed whether they are rich or not but the rich have more power to do anything about it.
the poor also have much to teach us.
# 45. 12/13/12 2:08 PM by Chris
Bob, you are welcome to share your beliefs as obviously ringing true to you, but of course just because you believe something does not actually make it true. Real, actual, theologians teach that the story of the birth of Christ is absolutely part of the mythology and Jesus was most likely was not born in a manger and of course not born anywhere near Dec. 25 and the pagan holidays that morphed into what we now know as Christmas. The nativity story does indeed emphasize the concept, which Jesus spent a great deal of my minister on, was that the King of Kings would be born in conditions of squalor. Jesus spent an overwhelming part of his ministry on the poor, the sick, the marginalized. This letter from church leaders is reminding us of that and our responsibilities.
Editor's Note: i am certain you and i will have lots of time in hell to discuss it.
# 46. 12/13/12 2:36 PM by Dave - New Harmony
Bob, I don't know if my comment is something worth posting since I'm not really commenting on your column, but rather a significant portion of the people who always comment on your columns. I read your column and skim through the comments virtually every day. It is astonishing the number of people who apparently have nothing but disdain for you, yet they read your column every day and take the time to tell you how much they hate you and everything about you. It's not the fact that people disagree that is astonishing. Or that they express their disagreement. What I see in the comments every day are people who make it a point to publicly tell you how much they hate you and how much disdain they have for you. They make quick reference to the column of the day, but the column is simply the vehicle through which they express their hatred. Of course, the portrait they paint is not one of you, but of themselves. What sad and ugly people they are. They think so much of their own opinions that they spit venomous hate when someone doesn't believe as they do. They sound completely miserable. I pray to God I never end up like that! I think I could be dying of cancer in a shack in Guatemala and I would be happier (and probably more successful) than these people.
# 47. 12/13/12 4:08 PM by hc
I guess the bishops forgot that the "THE WORLD" part of "FOR GOD SO LOVED THE WORLD THAT HE GAVE HIS ONLY BEGOTTEN SON" also includes ONE PERCENTERS.
And "tax" in Luke 2 actually means "registered" or "enrolled"(in the KJV, a translation I don't think any of these churches actually uses currently). So, must I conclude that between the four of these clergy members, not one of them has, or uses a Strong's Concordance?
or you have the poor with you always, and whenever you will you may do them good: but me you have not alwayshen
# 48. 12/13/12 4:18 PM by hc
Whoops!!! Sorry everybody... no, I wasn't typing in tongues there. What I MEANT to conclude with was:
For you have the poor with you always, and whenever you will you may do them good: but me you have not always Mark 14:7
If we put Jesus first, we will know exactly how to take care of the poor and disenfranchised. If we don't, we get the tripe that the Bishops cooked up.
# 49. 12/13/12 4:27 PM
Rachel asks: I’d like to know why God starved 40,000 children to death today...and yesterday...and tomorrow
You can go ahead and ask Him, but sometime between now and your next meal, Rachel, God's probably going to ask YOU the same question!
# 50. 12/13/12 4:34 PM by A Patriot - Lockport, NY
Like you, Bob....I am not worthy.
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